23 March 2010

Evidence of god

Here it is again from a discussion forum on Amazon. A very patient Michael Altarriba answering some questions from a christian. My additional comments in bold.

Do you only consider what you can see, hear, feel, and smell to exist?


Is this your evidence?

There's all kinds of evidence that isn't the direct stimulation of my sense organs.

We now know that a magnetic field surrounds our planet Earth. However, we don't have any sensory organ which can detect the magnetic field. We know the existence of the magnetic field through the effect of the magnetic field on magnetized objects. Science extends our sensory inputs. Many science disciplines also quantify the observed effects and record the effect as is. The interpretation of the data is open for anyone interested - and have access to the data.

What would evidence for God be for you, and why would you trust it?

Good question: I guess that depends on exactly how you define the word "God". Tell me what the word means to you, and I'll tell you what I'd like to see in the way of evidence.

But, really, since *you* are the one who believes that the word "God" refers to something which exists, perhaps you can simply tell me why you believe that word has the meaning it has...

Do you assume God does not exist because you have no evidence for God existing?

Well, I can't claim to *know* that no Deities exist, but, since I don't see any good evidence that any of them exist, I take the *provisional* position that they don't, just as I do for unicorns, leprechauns, fairies, etc.

If so, why?

Parsimony: using the simplest explanation that fits the facts. It's my preference.

Are there not a lot of things that you have no evidence for existing?

Sure... the aforementioned leprechauns, unicorns, fairies, and many other things.

Or, do you just say maybe God exists, maybe He does not?

I say I have no good reason to believe that any Deities exist, so I live my life as if they don't.

The problem with many religious is that they do not see 'god existence' as a provable fact. Since they cannot prove god's existence, many turn around and put the illogical demands on the atheists. If god exists, it must be able to be proven. Just like anything which exists, someone can find a proof of its existence. Atoms is a good example. We cannot see it, we cannot feel it, but it is everywhere and it is the fundamental building blocks of the natural world. The existence of atom has been proven beyond reasonable doubt. So if god exists, there must be a way to prove it. If no proof is found, the default position is that it does not exists.

The logic of prove of non-existence has long been settled. Demanding proof of non-existence is a demonstration of the lack of understanding of the working of logic.

Instead, I ask "What reason can you give me for believing that God exists?" you say. Why do you ask me this?

Because you claim to believe that "God" exists. Many other people believe in Deities, too. So, since you're *here*, virtually speaking, I'm asking you for your reasons.

Interestingly, this thread is started by this religious. The title of the thread is "How can an intelligent person actually believe that he can prove God does not exist?" Ditto above. An intelligent person does not need to prove the non-existence of god(s). No proof, no god. That's is logical default position. Until there is evidence of god, I am in the position that there is no god. I don't need any proof that there is no god. Those who claim there is a god need to produce the evidence to support their claim.

I am not your proof God does not exist, just because I cannot prove God does exist.

As always, I don't ask for proof... I ask for evidence. Have any?

Instead, I ask "What reason can you give me for believing that God 'DOES NOT' exist?" Could your answer be, no evidence? Yes it could,...

Indeed, it is.

... but as I have said a number of times, you having no evidence, does not mean evidence will not be procured in the future. Does it?

If and when it is, I'll evaluate it.

It took mankind 3 million years to prove atoms and germs existed.

We collected evidence to support the assertion that things we call atoms and germs exist.

Where is your equivalent evidence for the existence of Deities? And, if you don't have any, why believe?

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